Pregnant Spanish Man Ruben Noe Coronado Is Set To Give Birth To Twins. Ball’s In Your Court, Thomas Beatie.
23 March 2009, 10:30 AM. By Alex Alvarez
Ruben Noe Coronado, 25, is the first Spanish transman to be pregnant, and the first transman in the world to be pregnant with twins. In a story similar to that of fellow famous transperson Thomas Beatie, Coronado underwent fertility treatments himself when it was discovered that his girlfriend (who has two children from a previous relationship) could not get pregnant again.
Once he gives birth, Noe says he will continue with his sexual reassignment surgery in order to remove his female reproductive organs.
Noe, who was adopted, says he isn’t too sure how public he wants to go with his story:
To protect my children I’m not going to sell my story now or in the future. I’ve gone public with this so people start to see a transsexual pregnancy as normal. But I am thinking of selling the picture everyone’s going to want of me looking pregnant. If I don’t do it, someone else will and they’ll make a fortune.
Noe has compared being transgendered to “having three hands.” Except one of those hands sometimes makes odd noises and totally dictates public perception of your identity.
So does this mean we aren’t getting any photoshoots of Noe flying through the air with doves? Because, if he does, we’ll likely never be able to look at Bob Balaban the same way again (i.e. with unbridled lust).
Click Below for More Famous Pregnancies
Spanish ‘man’ is pregnant with twins [Telegraph]
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Good for him, finding his own happiness. I would like to know how he is going to handle the conversation with the kids one day - Daddy, who is my mommy? That’ll be interesting.
Man or woman a pregnancy is a gift from god whether transgendered bi sexual or homosexual if GOD did not want these people to give birth the MIRACLE would not happen reguardless if medical science helped or not..Remember God is the creator he can make or break and just to ask the rest of these closed minded folks below who died and left you in charge of judging others again that job is reserved for GOD himself not you prejidice freaks!!!!!!!
Are you freaking out on me?! LOL ok, but, how am I being the prejudice freak??
It’s people like you and your way of thinking and living that GOD flooded the world, because of all the currupt sick things people were doing! This isn’t GOD’s doing! It’s man’s doing… This man/woman whatever it is, is unfortunatly sick in the head and I can’t even imagine what his/her’s thier children will go through in life!
GOD should teach you to spell dummy
God has nothing to do with this pregnancy. Just because He allowed it, does not mean He approves of it. The same goes with the fact that He allows wickedness from men on the face of the earth, but he still allows it to take place. However, God is not a supporter of wicked men nor their decisions, but He permits them to do what they want because He is a God that allows us to be free in our choices. Things that are going on now with the changes of men & women bodies for their own pleasure is not new! The same things were going on during the time of Sodom and Gomorrah. If you really were led by the Spirit of Christ, you would not charge God for changing this man’s body nor situation. It was totally the man’s choice! Again, this is not God’s way, it’s man’s way. The Book of Proverbs 16:25 teaches us that “There is a way which seems right to a man, But its end is the way of death.”
just saying you are a man doesn’t make it so. Men can not have babies. Women have babies. When will the media stop supporting these factless stories. She is a women….get it?
I agree!! Why is it newsworthy that a women is pregnant. Even if she chooses to live as a man she is still a women.
You can shave her head and put on clothes that pertaineth to a man but this is still a WOMAN!!!! Men can not and will not ever give birth to children. This is a job for women and women only! God created Eve for Adam period! Not Adam and Steve. The plumbing is still of a woman even if it looks like a man.
OMG, did you actually just use the archaic “Adam and Steve” bullshit just now?! I wish you would pertaineth to shut up.
OMG…archaic??? Adam & Steve bull- - - - Yeah Adam and EVE is a bit archaic, guess cuz it was, afterall, in the beginning….how God created us, including you, you dumba- -!!!
Guest, you are absolutely correct. I believe EXACTLY as you do. Unfortunately people desire to believe the wrong thing because it lessens the guilt of what they are doing. And, yes, I really believe that. Guest, I know you must remember that the Bible even says we would come to this place in time. You know, when good would be called wrong and wrong would be called right…well we are here. This is a perverse generation content on believing wrong.
AMEN!!!!
Once again, ignorance finds a mouth…or in this case a keyboard. No one said he was a man, it reports that he is a transman or transperson. Please get over your archaic attitudes toward sexuality and human identity, it really is exhausting just listening to you people spew forth your animosity and hatred.
Ruben, may God bless your family, however different it might seem to the world.
I am replying to the guest who wrote “Once again, ignorance finds a mouth…or in this case a keyboard”. I guess you can’t read huh it does call she a he. “Coronado underwent fertility treatments HIMSELF when it was discovered that HIS girlfriend (who has two children from a previous relationship) could not get pregnant again”. No freaking man can get pregnant, only a WOMAN does.
This is my opinion… knock it all you want… I am in total agreement this the person who wrote that pregnancy is a job for women and women only… this is the way we were created, why twist things! If you are unable to bare children, why not adopt? There are children all over the palnet without a home, a family and in poverty, why not help those who are already here, instead of bringing children into this confused world????
i’m sorry, but, i don’t think any child should have to be put into THAT situation. i mean, you really want to take a homeless child from one hell and put him into another?! what did the poor kid do to deserve that!
This world is getting sicker by the day….bull the he/she is a woman, nothing else need to be said. The doctor’s can change all of the organs but the birth certificate will still say GIRL. Do you people think God is crazy…if he made you a man that is what it is…if he made you woman that is what it is. Please don’t let the animals have more sense than human…they actual know that they need to opposite sex to pro-create.
What about people with Klinefelter Syndrome, who were born with an extra chromosome? XXY? Did God do that on purpose? Was He a little drunk when that happened? Or did He really put a person on the planet who would look a little screwy to others for the sole purpose of ostracizing them? A benevolent God indeed.
Mickaela, God never ever makes a mistake. What we have done is blamed our reaping of sin individually and generationally on God. The Bible tells us the sins of the father will be visited on the children for 4 generations. Think of it, if no one in your line ever repented and owned up to sinning how many generations would be cursed and the type of curses that would be visited upon those children. We cannot, or, at least, should not continue to blame God for our wrongdoings and what we reap as a result of them. It was written down long ago in the Book there would be consequences.
Soooo…they’re suffering for their parent’s (parent’s parent’s) sins?
Absolutely! Some of us are very much suffering for the sins of our fathers. That is why we as parents are called to be more responsible because what we do with our lives doesn’t just affect us. It touches everyone and everything in our sphere of influence…that principle, my dear, is Biblical.
John 9
1 And as Jesus passed by, he saw a man which was blind from his birth.
2 And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?
3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.
Transsexuality is a form of congenital Intersex condition. Masculinised brain in Feminised body or the reverse. We know that now from autopsies and fMRI scans, and there’s an upcoming seminar on the subject at the American Psychiatric Association - seminar S10. The Neurobiological Evidence for Transgenderism
1. Brain Gender Identity Sidney W. Ecker, M.D.
2. Transsexuality as an Intersex Condition Milton Diamond, Ph.D.
The only way a man in such a situation can become a biological parent - unless some other, severe and exceedingly rare Intersex conditions are present too - is to give birth before their bodies are changed to align with their brains.
That’s not of God. There’s a little thing called entropy which is the break down of the universe and the proper order of natural things. It started when Adam committed the first sin. The Bible even talks about it saying “The earth waxes old”. Our DNA isn’t getting stronger it’s breaking down. Bottom line for this situation is, sin is sin. God doesn’t put perameters up for which sin is worse. He calls all sin bad. Murder and gossip are all in the same boat. I believe that homosexuality and “little white lies” are just as bad as one another. And as for people who are born with mixed dna…. it’s just their thing to wrestle out with God. That’s not one for any of us to decide, it’s between God and that person. The Bible says that you are supposed to wrestle out your own salvation. People born different aren’t put here to do anything other than love God. That’s the whole reason any of us are here. And if some one shuns them just because of a birth defect that person should ashamed. Christians today for the majority aren’t living what they preach. They’re the ones that are out there committing socially acceptable sins and passing judgment on people who are no more guilty than themselves. I am very sorry I can tell you’ve been hurt by someone like this before. Take it from someone who was born with a socially unacceptable birth defect it’s hard to get to the point where you’ve gotten the air clear between yourself and God. But once you get there it’s amazing! Life couldn’t be better.
I am so glad for you coming into a glorifying relationship with God. That is awesome and, yes, we ll have to work out our own salvation. But that does not discount what the Word of God says about curses. We have no idea in what form those curse may come. I do believe in the Bible from Genesis to Revelation and I try not to make it fit my own Word but to use it to glorify the Father in my daily living. Yes, people are sinning to the left and to the right. I don’t believe it is any particular group of people either Christian or non-Christian…it’s people. However, it is unfortunate that it is the Christians who sin that have a tendency to be held up in the spotlight more. To them that do sin I leave the what comes next for them to God. In the meantime we are called to spread the “Good News” and that is their is a Savior for whatever your ailment.
So basically, “that’s their problem” and they have to deal with it? I kind of have to say that’s pretty shitty. Where do they fit into all this religious zealotry and hate against people who aren’t “normal”? What if they like how they are, but keep getting called out for being a homosexual when it isn’t even known that it is something biological inside of them? Yeah, those are the “bad” Christians, just as I’m sure some slave-holders scorned the “bad” ones who lynched their slaves. Oh, we don’t all do that, just the bad ones, the rest of us are good.
And of course, because I care about people who don’t fit into the norms of “male” or “female” I must deal with this personally. I guess I’m just a homosexual-loving man-hating gender misfit.
Mickaela, I think you misunderstand me. I’m not calling you to be a hatemonger. What I offer is what the Word of God says…it really is just that simple. We have complicated so many things it is ridiculous. I live my life based on the Truth. I’m not someone who promotes “hate” that goes against the very Word I believe in. I am quite capable of knowing and discerning sin in a person’s life based on the Truth without it crippling my ability to show Godly love towards that person. The Father saw fit to equip us well. What we do with the tools He provided for us is up to EACH person. I can only be responsible for how I respond to someone not how others respond. I have been the recipient of alot of hate but I’m still standing…standing on the Word.
well, i think that it is not our place to judge. let god take that responsibility.
As for these cases of having both sex organs I think a lot of this comes from using drugs. Even if the mother was not a drug user I think that it can be carried down through the family. I don’t really care what this man/girl wants or needs. I worry about the child he/she is about to give birth to. I know after the child is grown he or she will try to understand but I don’t think I would ever understand and I am 39 years old. I think no doctor should play GOD. Women that can not have children should try to fill the void by getting involved in there town and help children that need it. Get a job working with children. Something other that having doctors play GOD!!
Why do you think this? There’s no evidence for your belief, is there?
Zoe, I commend you on the John 9 reference regarding father’s sins being visited upon the children. However, it seems to me that science supports the Bible. Either the child can have this condition as a result of their individual sins or the Father’s sins, lastly, to glorify God. The verse you used from the Bible was a scenario in which the man was blind at birth to glorify God as Jesus healed him of his blindness. Because you medically defined the conditions that does not disprove it Biblically, in fact, again, I say Science supports the Bible.
“Please don’t let the animals have more sense than human…they actual know that they need to opposite sex to pro-create.”
You do know that a decent percentage of other members of the animal kingdom are gay, right? For mallards, for example, the percentage is 11%.
Birth Certificates get changed in most jurisdictions after someone transitions. Certainly they do in 47 of the 50 states in the USA, and this has been the case in some of them since 1955.
You really have to come up with a good definition of “male” and “female”. One that covers everyone, so no-one is neither, and no-one is both. This is easy for 59 people out of 60, hard but doable for 999 out of 1000, and just about impossible for the rest.
The conventional Gender Binary is a really good approximation, but it *is* an approximation. Not every man has a body that’s wholly male, and not every woman has a body that’s wholly female. And a very few people don’t identify as either, and have bodies that defy categorisation too.
Hey Fredo… It seem funny to me you say,”OMG” is He really, I mean do you believe and accept God? I wonder then why you would call it, “archaic” to reference God’s Holy Word. In the beginning God created. He also changes not! God performed the first marriage ceremony between one man and one woman. Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, (again one man and one woman) and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. Genesis 2:24 And to the other guest…this transman or transperson is still a female but believes she should have been born a he. The article didn’t say this person was born a hermaphrodite. Oh by the way it’s not hatred it’s shocking that people are saying a man is pregnant, and folks are believing it. If it ever did happen just what would be the birth canal?? Ouch!
Okay, okay you got me on that one.
Correction: Oh your God, did you actually just use the archaic “Adam and Steve” bullshit just now?! I wish you would pertaineth to shut up.
You and I must have different gods. The God I like to think of wouldn’t condemn this person for trying to live their life how they want and find some happiness as well.
I know that we definitely believe in different Gods. My God is the God of the Bible…Yahweh. And guess what? He definitely DID NOT approve of everything everyone did just to make themselves happy. In fact, He was downright angry at some of the lengths people went to in the pursuit of happiness. I can only assume you, Fredo, are not serving the Lord God Almighty of the Bible.
Well it’s awesome that your life is so black and white and can be easily dictated by a book written by old men.
Written by men, yes, but inspired by God. Who is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Fredo, the truth will always be the truth no matter what year, truth will always be black and white whether we like it or not. We can try all the day long to change it, twist it, and circumvent it…but truth is absolute and not relative based on circumstances.
Adopting is different because the kids will have different DNA than yours. They will look different. Nothing compares to having you own child. We aren’t twisting things, we are just using using new methods that weren’t available before.If s/he is able to bare children. Why not use it? Dumb people contribute to make this world so confusing when in fact so many things are simple. People have the right to live a different life than the boring/straight/traditional stuff you are used to. It’s not bad, just different.And makes him happy. You would probably feel better if it read “transgendered man committed suicide” that way it would confirm your taught that transgendered people have mental issues. Right. Better you feel like crap and this guy lives a nice life with new kids than you making a more boring world and teaching other people to be hateful to everything their little heads don’t quite fully grasp!!!. Go Ruben
And sex isn’t,t only for procreation
Tis is so fucking stupid….he is a damn woman…Men aren’t meant to have children…Wat da fuck has this world come to…
your all going to hell
That is just sick!!!! What are wrong with these people. If you want to have children you need to be a women just like God has planned
Enough! Please! Doesnt it say in the Bible, let he without since cast the first stone? Last time I looked in the good book, we are all born into sin. Doesnt the Bible also say, Do not judge less ye be judged? Frankly, I think it is wonderful that science has come this far. Remember that when you are the one accepting care from a stem cell gown in a dish!!!
Yes, the Bible says all of that but as usual it is being quoted out of context.
@Guest: Well then treasure it. Treasure that fact that it’s easy for you to be on that side of the fence. Treasure that your life is so clear-cut and mapped out. Treasure that you aren’t on the other side of the fence, where everything isn’t so easy and where your life is ridiculed and subject to having hate and intolerance thrown at it. Treasure it, because next time around it may not be.
Fredo, make no mistake my life is not easy. I have dealt with many many things and NONE of it was easy. I know EXACTLY what it is like to be hated and not tolerated. I know what it feels like to be ridiculed because of color, gender, and sexual orientation. So indeed I do treasure the peace that I have found. I treasure not having to make up my own truths but just plain old accepting truth…it has set me free. I still live with all those intolerances but God is God and He will be the one to right the wrongs. However, I will not let His Word be mishandled…I will stand up for what is right and true.
Hey Fredo, I guess we have separate Gods. Mine is the heavenly Father, God the creator. The one who makes the Air we all breathe If this isn’t your God as well then I guess it’s the one referenced in John 8:44 “Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.” God is a loving God but He also wants our obedience. He is slow to anger but we will still be judged for our actions. You can try to tell me a orange tree is an apple tree all you want but it doesn’t change the TRUTH it’s still an orange tree. I am not trying to condemn anyone from anything, but truth is truth. Ruben is a woman, who is pregnant having twins, get over it people…Truth is Truth no matter how you try to twist it.
Did you just insinuate that I worship satan?! That’s pretty uncalled for. You act like my name is Cindy and I just posted something about Jackie Guerra
Right?!
Thank you finally someone gets it, your a man. Get over it. If you can have a baby your a woman, so be one. I would never treat you like a man, people need to take a stand and treat men like men and women like women.
That is a woman trying to be a man but she is still confused cause she/he is having a baby. She/he needs to make up his/her damn mind because those babies will be here and they need to make sure which role they would likie to play and not confuse those babies. This world is getting so sick and twisted… no wonder some of these kids these days turn out to be confused beacuse we as their protectors and role models cannot get their damn mind in order.
I do believe we’re living in the days of Noah. And you know what happened to those people. Not very pretty.
If a person wants to be a man or be a woman or whatever you want to call it, so be it, that is there choice. BUT to confuse the issue and to bring an innocent human being into the mix….just not right, in my opinion. There are plenty of unwanted children in our own world that would love to have a homelife. Why have we become such a selfish society?
Because we stand for nothing and tolerate everything. We are a society in moral and ethical decline.
I believe in the same God as you bible preachin’ people, but I also believe in not judging people.
There is a difference between judging and discernment. I think alot of the times we confuse the two. And unless people really do understand the context that judge not lest ye be judged is used…I personally don’t believe people should quote the verse.
This is nothing more than yellow journalism at its best and a chance for someone to have their 5 mins of fame. As long as this human being has female reproductive organs, this person is a woman. Furthermore, without male hormones this person could not pretend to be nothing more than a woman. Of course, she can wear male cloths, shave her head, let her arm pit hair grow, she is still a woman. No one should be offended by unwanted coments, if you put yourself on the limelight this is what is going to happen. If they want privacy, they should keep private but when you open the doors to your sexuality, what do you think is going to happen? Now, if they were a couple who were having these children and the news came to their door and created all this then I would have a different take. But, they are not, they want their 5 mins fame, so they need to suck it up. No matter what this is a gay couple, no sex change is going to change that. It is their lives so stop making it ours!
since everyone is putting their two cents out, i might as well. i can’t help to notice that just about every person who is against transexuals and such keep commenting on how GOD did not create “her” to turn around and change “her” sex into a male. well this is FOOD FOR THOUGH maybe not everyone is a believer of god. millions like I, have different beliefs on how mankind came to be. so how about everyone take considerations that that man does not follow your path to death.
That is very obvious to me because my path does not lead to death but to life. And still when one sees a man drowning you are obligated to throw a lifeline. So saying as a Christian I am obligated to speak the truth and throw that lifeline. And to that end people consider me judgmental and intolerant.
Consider that just maybe this is a lack of acceptance for what God made. This woman became a man by surgery because why? Because she was not comfortable lying about how she felt about being a woman not so she could become a freak by your standards…Consider whether you would prefer that she lied so you could be comfortable. Sin is sin and none of us who breathe as humans can escape it. It may be each person’s lack of comfort with being different that causes so much hatred…toward self or others. It is the All Mighty that is meant to do the judging of the life each of us leads and any or all that judge are just as sinful. Sin is sin! So please take a step back and examine yourself. God put each and everyone of us here with challenges to overcome…maybe one challenge is to learn acceptance of God’s people…all people. Feel free to stand for something of course but understand that how you feel about anything is your own challenge! Projecting your feelings onto someone else to fix themselves so you can be comfortable isn’t possible. Live your life and enjoy it! It is all ok.
WHY DOES IT MATTER???? NONE OF THIS PERTAINS TO US AS INDIVIDUALS SO LEAVE HE/SHE OUT OF IT… LIKE SERIOUSLY GROW UP AND MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS
God is not pleased!!!!! It is very sad the things we tolerate and feel are normal. That is not a man. That is a woman having a baby. A man cannot have babies. How ignorant!!!!!!!!!!!
Oh…like you are right?? Minding your own business??? hmmm
well sorry to say but you have no right to say it isnt our business “as i agree” but seeing as how your participating in this conversation, as of right now, it is your business.
love covers a multitude of sins,quit bashing with your bible.
What is the Bible bashing? Knowledge is good and Biblical knowledge is great. It allows us to make the right decision and be forgiving. We do not use the Bible to bash but to inform.
THIS ISN’T ABOUT GOD, ITS ABOUT THE RIGHT OF YOUR FREE WILL AND PERSUE OF HAPPINESS. LET BE WHAT CANNOT BE CHANGED FOR ITS NOT RIGHT FOR MEER HUMANS TO JUDGE BECAUSE WE ARE ALL UNDER ONE CREATER AND WHO EVER YOU BELIEVE IN LOVE ALL OF HIS/HER CHILDREN.
everyone has their opinions and it sounds like this group of people will not agree to disagree but to keep bantering on about a subject that has long passed. debate is one thing but this is ubsurd
Sick sick sick. This person is a woman, yes a female. No matter what the surgeons knife may do she is still a woman; hairy? yes!, no breasts? - yes!.manufactured penis? - maybe BUT still a woman. When will the world get it? - this is the work of the Devil!!
OK that is seriously wrong and people really need to stop reporting on worthless “news” if that is what “she” wants to do go for it but I really don’t need to or care to know. enough is enough. There are way more serious issues going on in the world. Aint nobody wanna know about a transger (or whatever the PC term is) man being pregnant. That is just WRONG!!! In every way. What will they tell their kids, Daddy had you
I UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENT POINTS OF VIEW, AT EVERYONE HAS SHARED. BUT IN ALL HONESTLY WHY CAN’T WE JUST SEE THEM AS A COUPLE THAT WANT TO HAVE A BABY AND BE HAPPY FOR THEM. YES THEIR ARE PLENTY OF CHILDREN THEY CAN ADOPT, BUT IF HE/SHE IS ABLE TO BARE CHILDREN. THEN WHY NOT? HTEY ARE NOT ASKING US TO SUPPORT THEM. SO, WHY ARE WE MAKING SUCH A BIG DEAL OF THIS??? WE ARE JUST PICKING ON THIS PERSON, LIKE YOU DO A NEW STUDENT FROM A DIFFERENT COUNTRY. THAT’S NOT FAIR. WHEN THOSE BABIES ARE BORN, THEY WILL BE THE ONES WHO HAVE TO EXPLAIN TO THEIR CHILDREN, THEY DON’T HAVE TO ANSWER TO ANY OF YOU.
i dont see why everybody is making such a big deal! it is his body and he can do what he wants. he is just doing something that makes him happy! good for him, im proud of him! this is not the work of the devil. we make our decisions and this is what HE made so get over it. QUIT MAKING SUCH A BIG DEAL OUT OF NOTHING!!!!!!
NEWSFLASH people!!! It’s a WOMAN, not a man! Born with two X chromosomes, not an X and a Y. After surgery, it’s STILL a WOMAN, who for the sake of humanity should have been sterilized!
I can’t believe the media buys into this garbage! Instead of putting these sickos in the spotlight, let them go back in the closet where they belong!!!
Men with de la Chapelle syndrome have 46xx chromosomes, as do most women. Women with either CAI syndrome or Swyer syndrome have 46xy chromosomes, as do most men. And some women with Swyer syndrome have given birth,
Most people with Kleinfelter syndrome (47xxy) are just men with mild bodily anomalies, and some have become fathers. But a few are women, and some have given birth to daughters.
Then there’s people with mosaicism, or chimerality, both of which can lead to having both 46xx and 46xy chromosomes, depending on which part of the body you sample.
The most outrageous common Intersex conditions are 5ARD syndrome and 17BHDD syndrome. There, all babies with either of those syndromes are born looking female, but about half masculinise later, and look male later in life, Some can even become fathers.
In about 1/3 of such cases, the boys, the change cures pre-existing transsexuality. In 1/3, the girls, it induces transsexuality. And the other third are bigendered, and can function well in either gender role.
See “Gender change in 46,XY persons with 5alpha-reductase-2 deficiency and 17beta-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase-3 deficiency”. by Cohen-Ketternis, It’s available online.
It’s not that simple.
I feel everybody has the right to be happy no matter what. Some people take drastic measures to have a child and if this is what they have to do than so be it. Good for them!!!! Opinions are like assholes everybody has one and everybody thinks they are right. Leave them alone and let them be happy with their kids.
I want to congratulate this couple! The birth of not one but two beautiful babies is wonderful! I hope that this family find all the cooing and awing that new babies bring to be the most amazing experience.
I’m not in the least bit ashamed of who or what our family may percieve to be in public. (I would have registered but the page for some reason isnt loading correctly) My husband, is a trans male and he’s beautiful, kind and amazingly perfect to be my other half. He however, isnt able to give birth to our children 1) because he has no desire to and 2) he has health issues that prevent even trying. I cant have children myself because I have had cancer and now we know of a disabiling spinal disease that could be passed on to a child. So we are weighing our options as a couple. I think its WONDERFUL that this couple has chosen the route that is right for them. And basically thats all thats important. Sounds like the children will be raised in a very loving home with two good parents. Thats all (as a soceity) we can ask for, in my opinion.
Again, Congratulations. Dont think of the negative reactions. children are a blessing no matter how they come to us. And be who you are, love yourself because after all if you DONT, you cant love anyone else!
Who are we to judge if all us have sinned thorugh out our lives. Many of us could say, I HAVE NEVER SIN. REMEMBER NEVER SAY NEVER, it will come back to you. We are all sinners in this world. And LEAVE GOD out. We all know the purpose of being in this planet.
We have more important things to BE focused on LIKE THE FINANCIAL ECONOMY. WHAT THIS IS NOT IMPORTANT!!!!!
Let God and God alone be the judge. Those of you who quote from a book heavily edited by Constantine and King James will be judged as well for your having set yourself up as judges. I wonder how many of you hypocrites would recommend an abortion…Fredo, you talk about how you have suffered the bigotry of others, yet you are intentionally bringing children to the world who will face a life of ridicule. Interesting.
I never said I was bringing children into the world. Where did you read that?
Reading comprehension, you’re doing it wrong.
Oh lord, the trolls have come.
Listen, trolls, people believe different things. It happens. If you don’t like it, then don’t do it. I don’t think Jesus would approve of you judging and being assholes.
Also, gender is a socially constructed concept that society defines. It’s not a necessarily biological innateness.
Quit hatin’ or I’ll go all Judith Butler on your ass.
Intersexed and Transsexual people know just exactly how big a role biology plays in defining Gender. If it played no role, transsexual people wouldn’t exist. They also know how Gender Role (rather than Gender itself) is 90-something percent a social construct that varies between cultures and times. In fact, you could define Gender Role as being all those parts of human “gendered” behaviour which have no biological basis, and :”Gender” as those that do, Most of what we think of as “gendered” behaviour is purely social construct, but a significant fraction is not.
But I don’t want to get into a Religious argument about Gender. Not quite as bad as Religious arguments about Religion, but close enough!
@Pazenlavida
ur right about gender normative and binaries..
i dont understand why people are so quick to jump to them lots of cultures accept third genders as a way of life for centuries
neways that man just wants to live his life I hope everything goes ok for him and his family…
There is obviously something VERY wrong with this. ONLY WOMEN should be able to have children. She decided to become a HE so too bad for her. I think this is digusting. It has nothing to do with being open or homophobic… something you just don’t do and this is one of them!
I farted when I read this
First of all i would like to say yes we are all sinners because as(Romans 5:12) says: “That is why, just as through one man sin entered into the world and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men because they had all sinned.” And yes we are not to jude no one as (Matthew 7:1-2) says:“Stop judging that YOU may not be judged; for with what judgment YOU are judging, YOU will be judged; and with the measure that YOU are measuring out, they will measure out to YOU.” But yes i will agree if she was born a woman she is a woman. First of all their not even married to brings kids into the world, if that way of living was alowed in God’s eyes. As (1 Corinthians 6:9-10) says: What! Do YOU not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God’s kingdom? Do not be misled. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men (including women lying down with women), nor thieves, nor greedy persons, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit God’s kingdom. And also you who’s talking about God and the Bible and yet you are continuing to curse? Because the Bible says at (Ephesians 4:29) “Let a rotten saying not proceed out of YOUR mouth”.
We are suppose to judge sometimes. For instance if your child wants to go over a friends house whos father is a known pedafile, should you still let him stay all night. No you make a judgment call. Plus should you judge the pedafile and tell him he’s wrong for wanting to have sex with children. In the same way we should judge this women who is trying sooo hard to be a man, yet still is a woman. The difference in this sin and alot of other sins,is your living in constant sin because of their homosexual lifestyles. God clearly states He hates it in the Bible and therefore so do I. I don’t hate the person just the sin. It’s a discusting and perverse thing. I pray God helps the United States.
Finally someone who actually understands the concept of biblical “judging”. Thank you…I hope people really gain understanding from your explanation.
I give him credit for doing this! I mean how do we know that in the future that men will not be able to have children? Look at some species of animals…if their are not enough males some of the more dominant females will change their gender so the species can survive….how do we know that this won’t happen in the future to our race? Some people are just scared of change. You go dude! Congrats I wish the best for your family
Hahahaha! Like we need men to start having babies so our race will continue. Stupid statement!
And she’s still not a man!
im not God to judge people but the only thing that reallyyy bothers me is that the media calls this woman man. they are woman trying to be man what ever identity problem they have they are WOMEN they where born FEMALE they are going to die AS FEMALE if they want to live there life as a MEN ok but dont say “pregnant spanish man” THAT IS JUST LIES LIES LIES
Ok! I do not believe in judging other peoples beliefs. BUT! I do not like when people bring the bible in to situations like this….THE BIBLE WAS PUBLISHED! It was put together and made by a man not GOD. You can fine so many of the published books in the book store.
hahaha….”manufactured penis”!!!!!! Its probably just a dirty meat curtain…..Just a thought…..
I’ll believe that this person is a “man” when I read that the twins or at least one of them was delivered through the penis that establishes his manhood”.
the thought, well hell, the damn picture of a pregnant “man” is absolutely disgusting. it doesn’t look natural. it’s sickening, literally sickening!!!
so does this guy have a penis?
It is so frustrating how everybody is arguing over this situation. Whatever happened to peace, love, and understanding? Freedom of choice, anybody? I love God but stop quoting the Bible so much and just be happy that this couple gets to experience the miracle of life. After all, children are “gifts from God” right? So stop judging and stop interpreting the Bible as God’s word–because it’s not. It’s man’s word “inspired” by God. Stop using it as a defense mechanism. Instead of condemning others who share different beliefs than yours, go do something productive with your life. We’re all put on this planet to coexist and love one another. Give it a try, it’s quite nice.
It is impossible for me as a Christian not to apply God’s inspired Word into my everyday life. That inspired Word tells me to (I will not quote the entire verse - Proverbs 3:5 & 6) “in ALL things acknowledge God. I repeat “ALL THINGS” not just the little itty bitty things and not just the huge-brain-frying issues but ALL things. So don’t ask me a Christian to leave God out of anything…I CAN’T and I WILL NOT!
why do people always have to throw GOD’s name into stuff like this? I mean seriously, if your “oh so magnificent” GOD didnt want something like this to be, then why the hell did he give man the knowledge and tools to do it? On the otherside of things, this is science, which is made by man…allegedly…so why is it that science CAN give a true “bible thumper” an influenza vaccine or antibiotic without being blasphemous, yet science cant make a man pregnant or clone a turkey without some religious maniac making up GOD’s choice of what is right and wrong? And aparently the other guest MUST be GOD, because how else would they know that “GOD is not pleased” with this? i mean my personal opinion is that there is something a little eerie that i dont quite understand about this, and i personally would not do this but i dont discriminate….to each his own and if doing this is rubbing pal’s buddha, then i say rub away!!!
While all of the mudslinging is going on, the truth of the matter is, this person is a female giving birth. Either the child she carries is her egg with sperm donation (meaning not her female partner’s DNA),or it is her partner’s egg with sperm donation (meaning not her biological child). Either way one of the couple do not have a biological connection and is therefore chosing to “adopt” the babies. The mother giving birth cannot be recognized as the father on the birth certificate. It is a legal document that recognizes it requires a male and a female to conceive a child. I am a Christian that does believe and follow the words of the Bible. But that aside, we have science to truely back up what God did. There has never been, nor will there ever be, a person that was born male that will be able to conceive and give birth naturally. This is scientifically impossible. Science backs the Bible in this case. Any so called “male births” that happen will be because humans are interferring in nature’s natural order. You will never see a rooster lay an egg, or a stallion give birth, or a stag give birth, or a bull elephant give birth. For all mammals birth is given by the female half of a pair. The other partner MUST be male.
Depends on your definition of “male”.There’s cases where people with 46xy (conventionally male) chromosomes have given birth. And cases where people with 47xxy chromosomes also. But more cases where they’ve fathered children, of course.
Most cases of “natural sex change” in humans are from female looking at birth to male looking later. Over 99% in fact. In all cases though, MtoF or FtoM, only the male-looking form is not always sterile.
FYI, when you have a transgender operation, you birth certificate, ID and everything else reflects that change. Yes,we do have to make judgement calls about SITUATIONS. The example of the pedophile is an instance where you make a judgement call about the safety of your child. The pregnant man/woman is not actually physically hurting you or yours. If you do like the life style he has chosen than don’t participate, follow his example or send him a baby shower gift. It is amazing how people get their undies in a bunch about things that have nothing to do with them. If God is really that unhappy with him and his choices, then God (not zealots here on Earth) will take it up with him when he dies. It must be nice for some of you to sit up on your moral high horse judging the rest of us. We all know most of the religious zealots in the world are just closed sinners anyway.
They full of shit either you are a man or a woman, it is not something like oh I want to have a baby so I’ll be a woman for nine months, then after woulds go back to being a man. You are what you are. Not a light switch on and off. Those children are going to grow up so confused. You better hope that God does not exist so what you are doing is right, than for him to exist and you burst hell wide open.
There’s a case where someone with a female gender identity had a male birth certificate. She looked normally male at birth. In 1985, at a fertility clinic, a simple physical examination diagnosed her as a “mildly intersexed male” due Partial Androgen Insensitivity syndrome. She looked almost normally male.
In 2005, she started having a female puberty, with attendant bodily changes, and after whole batteries of ultrasounds, MRI scans, gene and androgen series tests, the diagnosis was changed to “severe androgenisation of a non-pregnant woman”. In such cases, “male” and “female” can only be approximations, but she no longer looked remotely male, just abnormally female.
She’d always just thought she was a standard transsexual woman, and one who could (despite very great discomfort) live with a male body and in a male social role. She hated it, but was too afraid to do anything about it, You can see why she was terrified by just looking at the comments on this thread.
Most such “natural sex changes” are from female at birth to male later. She was one of the handful that go the other way. Her case is documented in COSMOS Science magazine.
It’s not as simple as you’d like to think. It is for most, 59 people out of 60 are 100% male or 100% female in body and brain. 1 in 60 are not, but even then, most don’t know that unless they have lab tests done, it’s not obvious. For perhaps 1 in 1000, it is obvious though, and inescapable. Such Intersexed people have enough on with the medical issues, without the legal and social ones. Issues that often amount to persecution, I might add.
I’ve found all the above statements very interesting.
One thing that keeps coming up again and again is that “if it makes them happy, then leave them alone and let them do it”
This makes great sense! So where do we draw the line? The rapist is happy when he rapes….the murderer was happy to kill…. the theif is glad that he stole the TV….so where do we draw the line? With this kind of reasoning, no one should be held reponsible for his/her actions. I’m mean, if it feels good and it makes me happy, then who are you to stop me from doing anything I darn well please?? And speaking of happines, what about the two innocent children? Do not think of one minute that these kids will stay out of the limelight. They WILL be picked on and harrased for the way they were brought into this world. There is NO Doubt about that!
All I see are two lesbian women bringing 2 innocent babies into the world. There is NO MAN in this story at all!
It all makes me very sad and as a parent, I just hate having to explain all of this to my daughter. The world keeps getting uglier and uglier……Come Lord Jesus, Come…… We have destroyed your world…..I can’t wait to get out of it!
RE: It all makes me very sad and as a parent, I just hate having to explain all of this to my daughter…
Are you kidding me? First, how old is your daughter that she is going to be aware of the situation? If she’s old enough that she will have stumbled onto a news report or this website, then I truly believe that she’ll be able to grasp what the article is discussing. If she’s not, then where are your marvelous parenting skills by not employing some means of content blocking on your computer or educating her in age appropriate material that she should see and read as opposed to journeying onto any site on the net?! Also, if you’re a great parent, does that mean that you will NOT pass your close-minded views onto your child? Will you ensure that she remains innocent to the bigotry, judgment, and faulty decision-making that you have partaken in?
There are too many individuals on this blog who are going with the assumption that just because these children will be born to people who think or look differently than you, that somehow they will be less loved or neglected or abused. Obviously these children are being born to a family who very much want them, who are anxiously awaiting their arrival, and who will love them just as much as you love your child. Don’t desecrate that. They will be parents just as you. They’ll have some of the same fears, worries, hopes, etc. And yet you judge them as wrong because they are different. Funny, when my parents were rearing me to be a responsible human being and to pass on the knowledge of such to my future children, they instilled in me something called ‘acceptance’. It’s how I, as a straight white female, have friends of both straight, gay, and lesbian persuasion. It’s how I dated men from other cultures or colors. It’s how I came to be married to the man I love and adore and how we are adopting a child of another nation - simply because I cannot bear children and I have a mother’s love to give. And guess what, I’m going to educate my child in acceptance as well. I suggest you learn how to do the same…
One point that hasn’t yet been brought up in this discussion is: There is an absolute moral code, and it is more important to obey this moral code than to be happy. Happiness is an ephemeral state of mind — some days we’re happy despite our circumstances, other days nothing can make us happy. In contrast, the moral code was originally laid down by the eternal God (who, since He created the cosmos, has the right to dictate how it shall operate). And He wrote it all down for us in the Bible.
I guess I’m sounding like a broken record here, but the point I wish I could highlight in big red letters is — Happiness is not the highest good! The endless, exhausting chase after happiness cancels happiness out. The key to our happiness as finite human beings is not the pursuit of happiness but the pursuit of God.
I think that this transgendered “man” has made a tragic mistake — she’s gone to extreme lengths in the hunt for peace and happiness, even to the point of sacrificing her original gender. She won’t find lasting joy this way. And the step she’s taken is so drastic that she has almost no options left. When she is forced again to confront the poverty of being that haunts all of us, what’s left for her to do? Where will she go from here?
There is an American transgendered man that gave birth to a baby a year or two ago and is due to deliver another baby in JUne of this year. I have seen only a handful of news stories about this particular child and one tv show. So far this child appears to be living a relatively normal life. The murderer and rapist commit their acts out of a desire to hurt/kill other people. The only thing this couple is doing is loving each other and trying to create their own biological family. Sorry,God didn’t write the bible, MAN wrote the bible. God is perfect, man is not perfect and can not be counted on to reliably translate God’s desires into words without being influenced by their own human bias. I don’t see how any person can fault this couple for trying to create their own family. I dread explaining to my daughter why two people loving each other and trying to create a biological family together is seen as such an awful transgression by so many people.
Most children born with disabilities, children with glasses,braces, short kids, fat kids, downs syndrome kids, ADD kids, will all be harrased at some point in their lives. Anyone different is harrased, kids are cruel. So maybe, any kids that will be different, we should abort them to save them the pain of being teased.
Several Points to make…
1. Gender is not a state of mind it is a fact. We are not like parrot fish who can change there gender if the other is lacking
2. so many comment on that its diffrent to adopt than have your own kid let us be reminded that the girlfriend cannot be the mother of rueben’s kid somebody else is the father so the girlfriend will only be adopting
3. So many are also quoting that the bible pushers are being judgemental- well they are and validity of the judgement comes from whether or not you TRULY believe in GOD. If you do not, though your behavior really isn’t acceptable, we simply have to hope that some intervention will happen for you and that you’ll be able to live as you should. If however you do claim to be a Christian, then other christians have every right to get on your case with the assumption that they are not guilty of similiar faults. When Jesus said he who is without sin cast the first stone please remember that He quailified to throw that stone. The lady was obviously guilty because they pulled her out of the bed (the guy was guilty to but double standards are another rant) However He came so we would not have to be slaves to the issues that would merrit us to be punished.
4. as far as congenital defects it is sad, but as complex as the reproduction process is it shocking birth defects dont happen more often. Also keep in mind that all the crap we do to ourselves and the environment might have something to do with it
Its so amazing knowing as far back as our fore fathers who founded our great country,of which their structured guidlines coincided with Jesus Christ our Lord God and Savior. Wake up people. Our God is a jealous God. I am the Lord thy God though shalt not have strange gods before me. Our Constituion for heaven’s sake indicates God in it’s form and structure. If you don’t follow Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth. Because our way are not his ways, nor are our thoughts his thoughts. Get ready for he is coming. Get right with God while you are able to. God Bless American and the World.
Two thoughts surface in reply to the poster who says that man wrote the Bible.
Thought #1: If you don’t admit Scripture as evidence, on what basis do you conclude that God is perfect?
Thought #2: I wonder whose interests are really paramount in this mixed-up situation. Is this lesbian couple primarily concerned with the welfare of the child they’re about to bring into the world, or is their main concern their own happiness and fulfillment? Judging by the lengths they’ve gone to and the extreme steps they’ve taken, I’d bet the latter.
I wasn’t going to comment because really no one gets anywhere arguing online, but after reading the extensive array of comments by close-minded individuals, I had to say something.
#1 - For all of you out there berating the mind set of this transman who decided to have a child and stating that it’s a woman’s job only and only women can conceive, get over yourselves. If that were solely the case, then what about women who cannot bare their own child? Women with endometriosis, cervical cancer, etc? Did all of those women commit some atrocity or sin against God and that’s their punishment? What about those instances where conditions like that are hereditary - did that whole family line commit an atrocity against God? I’m curious…
#2 - Prove to me that God exists…please. I don’t mean Jesus Christ, supposed son of God. I’m not talking about the scriptures who are the creation of various men. I’m not talking about creationism that science has long since disproved. For all of you bible-thumpers out there, tell us honest, black-and-white proof that there is actually a God. I want to hear something more than just your faith that tradition has carried, convoluted, and corrupted over the years. And, excuse me, but when did being a Christian make you almighty and perfect?! Isn’t that some of the same philosophy shared by others pretending to be God - Hitler, Stalin, bin Laden, Castro? When people stop using religion as an excuse for their own failures and their own bigotry, then we’ll really get somewhere in this world.
Oh - and please don’t cast a diatribe in response to my posting about how I’m going to hell - one actually has to believe in the existence of that fairytale for it to have an impact.
Best of luck and congrats, Ruben, to you and your family!!!
I would ask you to show me the science that has disproved creationism. I’m talking hardcore, no scientist disagrees with the findings. I think you will be hard pressed to accomplish that task. Fact is, how it all began is PURE THEORY all the way around. Additionally, I would ask you to present proof to me that God DOES NOT exist. If you can give me tangible proof that there is no God I will denounce my belief in Him…right now! I will never again pray to Him, praise, or glorify Him in anyway.
See The Mind, The Brain, and the non-existence of an Interventionist Deity.
I’ll quote, but you have to look at the original to see the justification:
“One thing though that has been lost in the shuffle: the disproof of the narrowest definition of Theism. We can’t prove that the Universe wasn’t created. We can prove that if a creator (or Creator) existed, then only Deism is consistent with the facts. That such a Creator certainly can’t be Omniscient - for as an observer, the Creator would cause the collapse of wave-functions that we know remain indeterminate. We can show that any Divine Intervention would require things to be quite different, and outside existing physical laws.
It’s possible to postulate such an Entity, one who can do anything, outside all physical bounds, but such an Entity would be utterly ineffable, and completely outside our understanding in even the smallest respect. If He can do anything whatsoever then there’s no point in saying that anything is cause or anything is effect. The Invisible Pink Unicorn does the lot.
Maybe so. And maybe you who are reading this blog only came into existence a microsecond ago, complete with memories and a whole physical Universe to exist in. I can’t prove you didn’t, and neither can you. All you have to do is to suspend all physical laws, which the Invisible Pink Unicorn has to be able to do in order to intervene in even the smallest way.
To me, a really impressive Deity would be one who sets the ball rolling, then gets out of the way, hoping and expecting that after the requisite eons of cooking, that the recipe will be a success. Perhaps not the first time He’s done it, either. Making Friends, as I’ll explain later.
…
You might note that I haven’t mentioned morality above. That’s because I consider it to be an an entirely separate issue. If something is Evil, it’s Evil, regardless of whether a Big Bully Policeman in the Sky will send anyone to an eternal torture-chamber for not for doing it. Similarly, if something is Good, it’s Good. And would be so even if doing that meant Eternal Damnation at the hands of “Infinite Power and Infinite Sadism”. But that’s another story… ”
I’m in favour of teaching Creationism by the way, teaching the controversy.
First teach Biblical Cosmology - that the stars are afixed to a hemispherical beaten metal shield keeping out the “waters above”, vs the more conventional model. Working out how we might distinguish between the two competing theories.
Then teach Biblical Meteorology - that rain is when the windows of heavens open, and clouds are the dust from God’s feet as he walks on the Firmament, vs a more conventional explanation. I’d also add other theistic theories, especially the Thunderbird and Thor ones, and get students to perform experiments to see what evidence there is for each of the theories. The 18th century work on Churches without lightning rods, vs Taverns and Brothels with them is instructive here.
Then I’d move onto Creationism, starting with the theory of Ameraterasu, then the Rainbow Serpent, Kronos, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, the Invisible Pink Unicorn, Allah, Brahma, and various other postulated Creationist deities. Challenge the students to come up with experimental data to distinguish between these theories. We’d also in passing cover the more conventional theories on the origin of life, especially the historical record of natural speciation in Hawaii, and the recent demonstration of “evolution in action” of E.Coli.
But I suspect that’s not what the Creationists on boards of Education would like. They only want one arbitrary religion to be taught, not the various Creationist theories.
What I am expected to do here is believe one author’s version of events & theory over the other’s.
I chose to highlight this portion of your quote because that is exactly Who and What God says He is (that is exactly how He defines Himself) BEYOND our comprehension. “His thoughts are not our thoughts, His ways are not our ways”.
“It’s possible to postulate such an Entity, one who can do anything, outside all physical bounds, but such an Entity would be utterly ineffable, and completely outside our understanding in even the smallest respect. If He can do anything whatsoever then there’s no point in saying that anything is cause or anything is effect.”
Until you can provide something more than theory that includes the possibility of a Divine Creator…I’m sticking with the One that has worked for me for so many years…Just like Job did.
The Lord Challenges Job
1 Then the Lord answered Job from the whirlwind:
2 “Who is this that questions my wisdom
with such ignorant words?
3 Brace yourself like a man,
because I have some questions for you,
and you must answer them.
4 “Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth?
Tell me, if you know so much.
5 Who determined its dimensions
and stretched out the surveying line?
6 What supports its foundations,
and who laid its cornerstone
7 as the morning stars sang together
and all the angels[a] shouted for joy?
8 “Who kept the sea inside its boundaries
as it burst from the womb,
9 and as I clothed it with clouds
and wrapped it in thick darkness?
10 For I locked it behind barred gates,
limiting its shores.
11 I said, ‘This far and no farther will you come.
Here your proud waves must stop!’
12 “Have you ever commanded the morning to appear
and caused the dawn to rise in the east?
13 Have you made daylight spread to the ends of the earth,
to bring an end to the night’s wickedness?
14 As the light approaches,
the earth takes shape like clay pressed beneath a seal;
it is robed in brilliant colors.[b]
15 The light disturbs the wicked
and stops the arm that is raised in violence.
16 “Have you explored the springs from which the seas come?
Have you explored their depths?
17 Do you know where the gates of death are located?
Have you seen the gates of utter gloom?
18 Do you realize the extent of the earth?
Tell me about it if you know!
19 “Where does light come from,
and where does darkness go?
20 Can you take each to its home?
Do you know how to get there?
21 But of course you know all this!
For you were born before it was all created,
and you are so very experienced!
22 “Have you visited the storehouses of the snow
or seen the storehouses of hail?
23 (I have reserved them as weapons for the time of trouble,
for the day of battle and war.)
24 Where is the path to the source of light?
Where is the home of the east wind?
25 “Who created a channel for the torrents of rain?
Who laid out the path for the lightning?
26 Who makes the rain fall on barren land,
in a desert where no one lives?
27 Who sends rain to satisfy the parched ground
and make the tender grass spring up?
28 “Does the rain have a father?
Who gives birth to the dew?
29 Who is the mother of the ice?
Who gives birth to the frost from the heavens?
30 For the water turns to ice as hard as rock,
and the surface of the water freezes.
31 “Can you direct the movement of the stars—
binding the cluster of the Pleiades
or loosening the cords of Orion?
32 Can you direct the sequence of the seasons
or guide the Bear with her cubs across the heavens?
33 Do you know the laws of the universe?
Can you use them to regulate the earth?
34 “Can you shout to the clouds
and make it rain?
35 Can you make lightning appear
and cause it to strike as you direct?
36 Who gives intuition to the heart
and instinct to the mind?
37 Who is wise enough to count all the clouds?
Who can tilt the water jars of heaven
38 when the parched ground is dry
and the soil has hardened into clods?
39 “Can you stalk prey for a lioness
and satisfy the young lions’ appetites
40 as they lie in their dens
or crouch in the thicket?
41 Who provides food for the ravens
when their young cry out to God
and wander about in hunger?
“Have you visited the storehouses of the snow
or seen the storehouses of hail?”
Yes, that’s covered in the Biblical Meteorology section. That belief in a literally inerrant Bible requires that snow and hail be from storehouses in heaven, rather than a product of water condensation at altitude. We can do experiments, making snow and hail in labs, and sending up aircraft and spacecraft to search for these storehouses, to see which theory fits the facts better.
I forgot to address what Creationist want taught. You stated all they want is their version. That is an untrue statement. What they want is their version included in the teaching and not excluded. You see everyone else’s theory and beliefs are acceptable to be taught but not the Bible version. It never ceases to amaze me of the tunnel vision of the exclusionist but we (Faith believers) are the ones seen as having tunnel vision.
Read what I wrote.That I’m actually in favour of teaching Creationism as an alternative. I just want it to be *all* of Creationism, including the cosmology, meteorology, and theories about various Gods being responsible, not just one particular view. Teaching the controversy.
You can even set up experiments - on a cloudy day, have everyone praying that the windows of heaven be opened, and on another cloudy day, praying that they remain shut but with cloud-seeding aircraft in the sky to see which is more effective. That’s Science.
Of course to do it properly, you’d have to repeat the test praying to various gods, using graven images, sacrifices etc, but I think the parents might object.
Zoe, you have not sufficiently proven that God does not exist. Thereby, the possibility of God as the Divine Creator works for me.
You can scoff at the metaphors used in Job but for me God is no less omniscient, omnipresent, or omnipotent. I also understand that you are for teaching Creationism. My dispute was your claim that the creationist only want their version taught-that was untrue. Again, they just don’t want to be excluded from the theories taught.
You know, it’s kind of funny to me, the only religion with any real opposition is Christianity. Anything referencing the Biblical God is being deleted from our society while simultaneously we are breaking our necks to insure everything else is accepted. To me something is wrong with that picture.
Should I pass today I know that I am ready to face whatever is on the other side of this life. And I guess that is all that really matters. I have a life of no regrets regarding how I lived and believed.
Okay, I think your questions need to be answered…so I’ll give it my best shot. I’m not trying to put you down for what you believe. I think that everyone’s sincere beliefs deserve a sober hearing. And no, I won’t pound you over the head with a Bible or holler that you’re going to hell. That’s not productive.
I am a woman who will likely never be able to conceive a child of my own, so your query about infertile women resonates! I don’t believe it’s true that infertility in all cases is some sort of curse. God does not delight in seeing His creation suffer. Whole books have been written on this topic, so I can only give a very cursory answer in the space I have. The original design of the creation was “very good”. The evil and suffering we see around us is the result of living in a world marred by sin. God’s answer to human suffering is profound — He became a man and lived among us, dying an excruciating and humiliating death.
I cannot give you absolute, black-and-white proof that there is a Supreme Being — just as you can’t give me absolute, black-and-white proof that there is no Supreme Being. Every worldview, whether it’s Christianity or Hinduism or paganism or agnosticism, is built on premises that must be accepted by faith. Just a quick question (not intended to be accusatory!) — what kind of proof are you looking for? What would God have to do to persuade you that He exists? Without readiness to believe in any given worldview (not just Christianity) even the most clear-cut proof can be explained away.
I’m sure you’re familiar with Pascal’s famous wager. He stated (in so many words) that if atheism is true we lose nothing by acting as though we believe in God; but if Christianity is true, we stand to lose everything by not believing in God. He felt that belief in God was the safer gamble.
The trouble with Pascal’s wager is there are so many gods to worship, and many of them condemn you to eternal punishment if you don’t pick the right one. Atheism is actually safer, as not all religions condemn Atheists, just heretics and believers in false gods.
Very nice explanation. And for the record, I never said all illnesses or abnormalities was a result of being cursed. That as usual was just the focus so as to have a reason to berate me for believing in God.
I don’t have enough faith to be an Atheist. I’m satisfied there can be no Interventionist Deity, that Theism isn’t possible, but I can’t rule out Deism. I even think it relatively likely. I certainly won’t criticise anyone’s sincere belief in Brahma, or the Flying Spaghetti Monster, or any other deity of their choice.
And for that matter, I consider the Bible (including the Apocrypha deleted at the Council of Nicea) to be an excellent general guide to morality. Not perfect, but better than anything else I can think of.
Please you are a woman,you just want to look like a man.Inside you are still a woman.SO YOU WILL ALWAYS BE A WOMAN.So for all you people arguing this topic stop,there are more important things to talk about than another woman having a child.We have children every day.
RE: what kind of proof are you looking for? What would God have to do to persuade you that He exists? Without readiness to believe in any given worldview (not just Christianity) even the most clear-cut proof can be explained away.
Real proof is irrefutable. Hence, if there was any type of proof that God actually existed, I might become a believer. There is not and therein, lies the problem. Look at Scientology, for instance. Ron L. Hubbard did state something along the lines of creating a religion makes a mint. People take anything on faith alone, without asking questions, probing, or truly trying to learn. Faith makes a mockery of the human race.
As to other religions - a lot of the aspects of the Bible and christianity are principles of paganism - and yet the “good” christians felt that gave them a right to try and destroy those races. Look at the Roman occupation of the British Isles centuries ago. In essence, they were trying to erradicate the very groups of people whose beliefs they incorporated into their own. Very sad.
Further - I wasn’t always of my current beliefs. I was reared by a Catholic mother and a Wesleyan-Methodist father - yes, they actually made that work and still are. But when I came of age, I became more curious and started asking the questions because the answers didn’t make sense to me. So, taking my early knowledge of the Bible, I have to ask - When did God become Jesus Christ and vice versa? Doesn’t the Bible list Jesus Christ as “son of God” and hence, a different individual or entity than God? If that’s the case, then God did not suffer the human punishments that befell his son. Watching your child suffer is not the same as suffering that pain yourself…
I am truly sorry to hear about your potential conception issues. I, too, share some of your pain.
One of the better arguments I’ve heard for the existence of God is the argument from the moral code. It seems evident that all of us humans (except for the occasional psychopath) adhere to more or less the same basic moral code: i.e. we agree that justice is desirable, that injustice is evil, that murder is wicked … etc. And most of us are aware that we come short of this moral code — we do things we know aren’t right: we badmouth others, we cheat on our taxes, and so on. So, we know what is right, but we end up doing what isn’t right. So where did this moral code (universal to all peoples and all ages) come from? It would seem that such an all-encompassing standard of behavior would spring from a being both good (since he formed the moral code) and powerful (since he can impose it on all human beings). The best name for this Supreme Being might be God.
I believe it is a serious error to rely on blind faith alone. I don’t feel that my Christian beliefs rest on blind faith. True, I can’t prove empirically every tenet of the faith, but those I can test in the field have turned out to be true. I use a similar reasoning process to that of scientists discussing paleontology. They use the bones that they have seen to prove the existence of dinosaurs that they have not seen!
It’s true that all kinds of horrors have been perpetrated in the name of God… but all kinds of horrors have been perpetrated in the name of atheism, too. It just goes to prove that evil people bent on killing will use any old rag of an ideology to shroud their wicked hearts and justify their unjustifiable behavior.
Theologians have been writing reams about the doctrine of the Trinity for centuries, so I don’t really feel I can do the subject proper justice in this brief space. One of the classic passages on the Godhood of Jesus Christ is found in the gospel of John, verses 1-14. God is one, but God is also three persons — Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. (I don’t completely understand how this is, I’ll admit!) Because God is “that than which no greater can be thought”, humans can’t expect to totally comprehend His nature. It is made clear, especially in the book of Hebrews, that God Himself entered nature in the person of Christ.
Thanks for being willing to discuss these touchy subjects with intelligence and wit!
People, if this person is female then why is she topless showing the web her boobs? She should have been in a porn magazine.
because she cut out her boobs
to the guy with the rant about proving God exists tell us what you believe and why
I was under the impression that if you are transgender it is because you believe you were born into the wrong sex and feel soooo strongly about this that you would go through reassignment surgery and all that that implies. If a natural born woman feels so strongly that she is actually a man than why would this person want to do the most feminine thing on the planet, being pregnancy and child birth? If these people have to go through years of psychological care then how does this not send up a red flag. I’m not against someone wanting to change sexes if they feel it is right for them, but how can you believe you are really a man with all your heart, yet still want to be a mother? I am not passing judgement with anger, I just really do not understand this.
He didn’t want to be a mother. He wanted to be a father. Due to biological limitations, this was the closest he could get to that.
I know how he feels, well, almost.
If you want to be a man be a man. Men don’t give birth real women give birth. Just think of how curel the world is what are you doing to your poor kids. In my opion you are a sick person.
In reference to the comment above about if God wants it to be then it will and God created this pregnancy. Do the words free will ring a bell. Think about what your statement would mean in a broader sense for the world. You cannot really believe that.
Well, if going to extreme lengths to have a biological family of your own is considered selfish, then apparantly all of the families that are adopted or come about by using assisted reproduction are wrong. I believe in God, but not neccesarily the same God you do. I don’t believe God codones passing judgement on others, I essentially trying to do his job. I do not feel as if that sort of hateful behavior is acceptable and hope that some intervention takes place for you so you can stop being a bigot and that God may forgive you for hate mongering and judgeing another human being guilty of sin while you are certainly not free of sin.
Is it wrong? I don’t know. Is it right? Not sure either. But the fact is that we don’t know how to respect each other. I believe that it’s OK to live your life the way you want, as long as is not affecting someone. Also, I can see here that when people believe in something, they start to think that everyone else should believe the same thing, and that it’s WRONG!!! Yes, religion its very important, but every religions states that you must respect and if you think someone’s life style is wrong well, let your god take care of it not you, because I am sure you sin as well and your god will take care as well. We don’t know the reasons of why people decide to do certain things and before we go all crazy about it, we should find all the facts and then talk about it but not judge it!!!!!!
Thank you!!
Why is this news? For real, why? Did he not own fallopian tubes? Because if not, then by golly Miss Molly, that would be news!
People are making news for having custom genetic kits installed and then doing what nature intended anyhow. Nothing against anyone who chooses to change to the person they want to change into, if you want a dingaling because you weren’t born with one, then go get yourself one..if You were without a vahjayjay and your chest left you feeling flat, well go fix it. To each their own. However, call me when a man has both vas deferens and fallopians then makes his own child A-sexually, then, give that dude some cash and headlines!
As a member of some Intersexed support groups, I know people with PMD syndrome - persistent mullerian duct syndrome, who indeed have both sets of internal plumbing- or parts thereof. Most are sterile. Not all though.
So, did God create the doctors and or science that can change a man to a woman or a woman to a man? Did God give the doctor or scientist the knowledge, the “brain power” to change that person? Who made the existance of a person that at birth appears to be a boy or girl, but as they mature, feel like the opposite sex? Could someone please consult with God and get back to me on this? Anyone have his email address? I have alot of questions.
I just want to see this MAN give birth thru his man parts. That’ll hurt!!!!!!!!!
after reading this story and the comments it baffles my mind, right or wrong its happening , as a Christian I know on judgement day it will be revealed one way or the other , its ‘ her ‘ ( Noe’s ) decision and hers only , so who are we to judge.
God has nothing to do with this pregnancy. Just because He allowed it, does not mean He approves of it. The same goes with the fact that He allows wickedness from men on the face of the earth, but he still allows it to take place. However, God is not a supporter of wicked men nor their decisions, but He permits them to do what they want because He is a God that allows us to be free in our choices. Things that are going on now with the changes of men & women bodies for their own pleasure is not new! The same things were going on during the time of Sodom and Gomorrah. If you really were led by the Spirit of Christ, you would not charge God for changing this man’s body nor situation. It was totally the man’s choice! Again, this is not God’s way, it’s man’s way. The Book of Proverbs 16:25 teaches us that “There is a way which seems right to a man, But its end is the way of death.”
As a Christian, there is nothing wrong with standing against wrong if it is wrong and standing up for right if it is right! This does not say you are judging. But if we want to speak on Judging then let us approach the Word of God and get the facts! The Gospel of John 7:24 says “Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.” The Gospel of Matthew 7:1-5 teaches “Do not judge others, and you will not be judged. 2 For you will be treated as you treat others. The standard you use in judging is the standard by which you will be judged. 3 “And why worry about a speck in your friend’s eye[c] when you have a log in your own? 4 How can you think of saying to your friend, ‘Let me help you get rid of that speck in your eye,’ when you can’t see past the log in your own eye? 5 Hypocrite! First get rid of the log in your own eye; then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in your friend’s eye.” We CAN Judge, but we CANNOT be as hypocrites judging! According to John 7:24 we as believers of God and those of us with the Spirit of Christ judge righteously…That means with mercy, tenderness and with the Love and Wisdom of God!
Very well presented maybe understanding of what “judging” is will result.
Just how exactly does a person of the opposite gender know what the other one feels. the male and female brains act differently yes but if you ask one side why the other acts a certain way they themselves can’t say. as for the who created the science to change whatever: people have this really bad tendncy to pervert everything that is created: Sex- pornography, rape, incest… Money - greed, medicine - abuse, capitalism- greed, socialism - oppression, fireworks - guns, cannons etc
The list is endless just because something exists and is accepted doesn’t make it ok and though I cant tell you how to act please understand that there is only one truth. it is your responisbilty to find it
There is no God.Only the atheist has the courage to admit the obvious: People spent their lives in the company of an imaginary friend. Of course, people of faith regularly assure one another that God is not responsible for human suffering. But how else can we understand the claim that God is both omniscient and omnipotent? There is no other way, and it is time for sane human beings to own up to this. It is terrible that we all die and lose everything we love; it is doubly terrible that so many human beings suffer needlessly while alive. That so much of this suffering can be directly attributed to religion — to religious hatreds, religious wars, religious delusions, and religious diversions of scarce resources — is what makes atheism a moral and intellectual necessity.
Now leave this person alone. As far as I know you are comitting a deadly sin….”Wrath” Right?
To the athiest:
You really shouldnt comment on things you don’t understand. if you look at the complexity of existance you would understand that this could not come into being by accident. if you break down the word athiest it is lack of religion. someone who doesn’t have religion cannot see that the things you listed are not done in the name of religion but under the guise of it. people are easily influenced because faith is seeing past what see. many people cannot or dont understand what they see and depend on someone else to guide them. if they fall under someone perverted, will act the exact opposite to what the religion describes hence cults and terrorists
It would first behoove you to understand the proper uses of grammar and punctuation - then you might actually be able to respond intellectually a post. Read, edit, and review. Those are statements to live by!
I THINK IF THESE FEMALES THINK THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO BE MALE AND DONT WANT TO BE FEMALE THE SHOULD NOT BE HAVING BABIES. MALES DO NOT GIVE BIRTH AND IF YOU ARE THAT ASHAMED OF BEING A FEMALE YOU SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO DO THINGS WOMEN CAN!!!
I agree with you GUEST. Sodom and Gomorrah was a wicked city and look at the time now we are at that stage of Sodom and Gomorrah, all signs that prophecies is telling, is coming true! There will be rumors of war, new unknown diease, man shall be lovers of themselves, homosexuality will rise, man will claim to be chris, just when we think the world is at peace, destruction will strike. God created us in his image, the transformation in ourseleves is on us not on God, and what ever generation God is curse, then yes they will be trans gender.
I THINK YOUR GAY 8===================D~~~~~~~~~~~~ =D
I can’t beleive you guys actually get all worked up over these things! We will NEVER all agree, everyone has a right to an opinion and freedom of speech. So let everyone have their say….(if they feel the need to waste their time) and then move on with your life. Go hug someone for crying out loud, cry on thier shoulder….go on….let it out!! IT’s TOTALLY OK FOR YOU TO FEEL THE WAY YOU FEEL AND NOBODY CAN CHANGE THAT!
-First of all god doesn’t exsist, if he did he wouldn’t allow people like george bush into power.
-second this man is doing his wife a favor since she cant produce offspring… The child would be biologically be thiers which is good… Better to have an offspring of your own than a free hand-me-down crack baby.
-Third this has nothing to do with god, so don’t call it a miracle
he got surgery done to him, it’s all scientific
-Fourth he’s simply sacrifcing himself a little to have the dream family he’s always wanted with the one he loves, that’s what most of us out there want aswell, just we won’t ever have to go this extreme. And he’s going to get changed back to his normal self afterward so there is no problem.
Isn’t it a shame when we are so blind to what is right before our eyes! Ignorance is born from the same source. Our new president is one that will also play his role is destroying our beautiful country. He will do it without it being noticed, a slow simmer and then we wake up to a changed society that removes liberty as we know it. As for the prego man, its a bold face lie. He’s a she and anyone with common sense knows that!
umm she’s in spain what does the president have to do with it. stay on subject
This is MAD!!!! No wonder why our world is so topsy turvy!! and we wonder why we are going through all these turmoil and trouble in the world now???. When man “human” wants to do things contrary to the BIBLE, then we have to suffer these consequences. I hope that you can remember what happened to Sodom and Gomoroh!!! This was done because men was lying with men and women with women. And for the fact, that thing is not a man. I said the thing because, it was born as a woman, then decided to do a sex change, but at the same time decides as well to leave all her reproductive organs as a woman. DOES THAT MAKE ANY SENSE TO ANY ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You are either or !!!!!!!!! You cannot have one foot in Connecuticut and the other in Florida. That spells trouble, and for the greater part….. you will be dead!!!!!!!! Jesus is coming back for the world and when he comes and everyone has to answer for them selves, some of the explanation I heard some people say about this so call “pregnant man”, gays and lesbian, I wonder what will be your response to those of you who are living such contrary and disgusting ways of life.
People wake up and and get right with God before it is too late.
I’m going to go out on a limb here, but your sociology is white, lower middle class with a very large bent towards Christianity, right?
I’m assuming that when you have sex, if you have sex, you believe in the classic man on top/woman on bottom scenario as well? Do the world a favor. Keep to yourself and let others do the same as well!
No matter how much we all agree or disagree the fact is what’s done is done and very soon there will be two little babies joining this world. No matter how perfect or imperfect the family or the world every child wants, needs, and deserves to be loved and cared for period.
To the Athiest.
Lets assume that you are right, that there is no God, lets give that one to you on this senario, then what is the worst that can happen? The worst thing is that there would be a whole bunch of unnescessary christians doing good, trying to live right, trying to enjoy the best of this world, living longer and having a sence of morality and judgement. Then when they die, they just rot. (worst case)
Now lets assume that you are wrong about there’s no God, That indeed there is a GOD whats the worst that can happen? here it is, We believe that there is a God who lives in Heaven and a Devil whose home would become hell. Whats the worst thing that can happen? Here it is… You would have lived your entire life in misery, Fear, with no hope.. there would not be (in your world) a difference between right and wrong.. good or bad…your life would be lived without any meaning and then when you die..( this is the greatest part) you would be sent to hell with the Devil and all his angels! burning alive for eternity.
If you ask me? I’d rather live my life believing there is a God than living it hoping that there isn’t one. You think about that.
I do not believe that I ever once said people didn’t have the right to choose their own beliefs. For me, the God fairytale does not work. I’ve learned to get past that and do not need that kind of “faith” to enjoy a fulfilling and happy life.
My main point was that the majority of Christians posting on this blog do not know how to “live and let live”. If they could learn that lesson, then the world would be a happier place. You posit that we should just all have faith and live merrily until the end of our days. That would work if we existed in Plato’s Utopia. Unfortunately, we do not. This helps explain why we see so many atrocities committed in the name of religion, the Father, God, Allah, etc. etc. Reading the myriad amount of postings from just such “believers” only reiterates that point.
Again, faith makes a mockery of the human race. Exercise some of the intelligence that you claim God provided to you and use it to question, form opinions, and thus, develop your own set of beliefs. I, for one, am not the type to accept what others try to spoonfeed to me.
Oh, and to set the record straight, I am a woman - born one and still one. I’m sitting here and laughing about the postings which list me as a man. As if only men could be direct, blunt, and educated!
I think anyone who wants to be transexual should just leave any children out of there lives. It’s not fair to kids to have someone who is gay. What kind of life is this for kids. If you want to have a pregency then shut your mouth and keep it to yourself.
I think what’s left out of this “Man Having Baby” discussion, is she’s not a man.
Did she get in fights with other boys behind the school? Did she shower in big open showers like men’s bathrooms or was it like most women’s bathrooms individual private stalls. Was she punched in the arm just because some dude wanted to punch? Did she eat cold pizza left out from the night before just because it was there? Does she have holes in her underwear cause she’d spend her last dollar on electronics before buying clothes? Did her mother yell at her for peeing on the floor or leaving the seat up? Did she do something bold and stupid just to impress a girl?
My point is that going up defines who we are. You can’t suddenly become a man by simple breast removal and testosterone injections.
You all need to just shut up already with all your goD crap! You cry that no child should have to grow up in a gay household. WTF! There are straight families that are much worse off than a kid having a gay family. At least in a gay family you know serious thought went into wanting and having the child. Instead of all the welfare accidents that happen everyday! You want to jump down someones throat about having a kid, why not start with that wacko that had 8 babies and already had 6 to start with. How well raised and cared for do you think those children will be??? Leave this family alone and spend a little more time worring about your own damn family!!!!
Why must you rant about the God opinions? There are plenty of other opinions regarding this story that are against what is being done and yet…only the ones with a God position are considered “crap”…how intolerant and biggoted.
Anyone thinking, “a man can have a baby” is just ignorant. To acknowledge such a thing as a man having a baby is ridiculous. This person is a woman! Only woman can have babies…she can have the dress of a man and even act like one. He is a woman having a baby! Ignorance will involve God in order to make this act something religious or miraculous.
just because straight couples drop the ball often with there children doesn’t mean gay couples are right for adopting kids. granted that they may very well be treated better than some straight couples but the optimal environment is a mother and father that act right
1st the saying is Bust hell wide open
2nd its hard for people to recieve the truth when its given with un-Christ-like tones and wording i.e. the cursing
I think it’s hard for people to receive the truth period. It could be presented with the utmost concern and love for a person. Case and point, Jesus, He is love and truth personified and yet not all received Him. Problem is people can’t receive the truth until God draws them near and reveals it to them.
It’s human nature to judge others. No matter what religious you do or do not believe everyone judges everyone else by his or her own standards. No one person can claim perfection in any aspect of their own lives because there is always room for improvement. Isn’t that what this person is doing? Whether we believe it to be right or wrong makes no difference. Each person must make their own choices and live with the consequences (good or bad) of that choice.
Well said, HVNSVANGL. Stories like this beg for people’s opinion. It is a shame all peoples’ opinion can’t be voiced without it being considered judgmental or bashing or intolerant.
Any story like this that creates diverse responses in such a heated manner is just the media’s way of saying “we have nothing else to report on so lets distract the public with an issue for debate so we can slack for a few hours while they bicker with unceremonious hatred for each others beliefs”.
well for those who keep saying to stop puting the Bible in this, i would like to say that since everyone puting their 2 cents in i would like to put mine in also. Yes we have a free will to live to serve God or not. Yes we’re not to judge. But how can you be happy for them. I don’t hate them i love them just like everyone else and i know its not none of my concerns, but do you think God is please with what their doing, NO! And neither am i. I truely stand up for what i believe in so if i feel like quoting the Bible i surely will. God does not, never will he ever love or like such wickedness he alows it but he will soon destroy it as (Psalms 37: 10-11) says: “And just a little while longer, and the wicked one will be no more, And you will certainly give attention to his place and he will not be. “But the meek(righteous) ones themselves will possess the earth, And they will indeed find their exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.” I’m a christain and i’m not a hypocrite yes i sin because i’m imperfect. nor do i throw my Bible in no one’s face i just speak the truth and that’s what i believe in. i’m a kind loving person that loves everyone and i do try my best to get alone with everyone no matter who they are. But when it comes to my religious beliefs i don’t and won’t tolerate such things, i know i can’t do nothing about their situation, but leave it in God’s hands. Everyone have their own oppinion and this is mine. Thank You!
Everyone is so focused on whether or not these people are right or wrong in their choice of a lifestyle. As a mother of 4 I feel compelled to say that each and every one of us is someone’s child. No matter the upbringing we have all been loved unconditionally by our parents. Even though that is not a lifestyle that I would choose my only hope and prayer is that these children feel the same unconditional love every child (past, present, and future) deserves to have.
yes i understand i don’t have kids, i feel i’m not old enough nor married to have kids, and since their are about to brought into this world if not already, yes they should get shown unconditional love no matter what, but they should’ve been conceive this way. And not all of us have been shown unconditional love from our parents.(speaking from experience). whether they are right or wrong, (i believe they are wrong) it’s nothing we can do about it so enough is enough about this i’m all for peace and unity.
It’s all about the big payoff! Sell my story………
I wonder if ones who so call claims that there’s no God have ever read the Bible before and took in a deep understanding of it.
Oddly enough, I the Atheist, have read the Bible…numerous times. What you fail to understand (and what has been proven), is that the Bible was a composition of works spanning centuries and the philosophies of numerous men. It is not the word of “God”. Further, the Roman Emperor Constantine produced the Bible, brought it into publication. He was a pagan, not a god. He went on to utilize the Bible as a deceptive military campaign that he waged against his enemies. A campaign so good it still deceives people today.
Perhaps if you read a little bit more and gained a greater understanding of things, you wouldn’t be pressed to make foolish statements that you cannot back up.
Yes, I’ve read all of it, including the Apocrypha deleted by the Council of Nicea. Personally, I like the poetry in the KJV, but that’s just a matter of personal taste, and doesn’t blind me to the many mistranslations and changes of meaning from the original texts throughout the centuries.
Now if I’ve understood “the bible” in whatever version you think is correct.. that’s a different matter.
I understand Matthew 22:35-40. I’ll use the KJV if I may.
35 Then one of them, which was a lawyer (ie a religious scholar learned in biblical law), asked him a question, tempting(ie attempting to trap) him, and saying,
36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
Rabbi Hillel, some 50 years before, when asked to define the law of the Torah while standing on one leg, said “do not do to another what would be hateful if done to you, all else is commentary. (Babylonian Talmud, tractate Shabbat 31a)
All else is indeed commentary. If you don’t read every single line of the Bible with this in mind, *YOU HAVE MISSED THE POINT*
As is made clear by 1 Corinthians 13:1-3. I’ll use the KJV again:
1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
Use Scripture to justify uncharitable acts, and you’ve screwed up. You can know Attic Greek, Koin, Aramaic, Hebrew, Latin, and study every fragment and parchment under the Sun, be a complete expert on every nuance of meaning in every edition of the Bible that’s ever been published…..and if you lack Kindness, you’re wasting your time.
Because I am Intersexed, and thus (KJV again) this applies
Matthew 19:12
12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother’s womb…
I also have to follow Isaiah 56:4-5
4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.
The terrible pun about “cutting off” is present and even more obvious in the oldest texts *sigh*. The Intersexed have always been figures of mirth and derision, even here.
I’m not a Christian because I don’t adequately follow the “first and greatest commandment”. I lack faith. But the rest, yes, I do that. Or try to.
It’s my partner who has the High Distinction in Theology from the Australian Catholic University though, not me.
Does this answer your question?
Zoe, on behalf of the ignorant at heart…I’m sorry for the mistreatment you have experienced. I’m familiar with how hurtful people can be because of lack of compassion or charity (love). It is the very lack of charity from others that has strengthened my ability to have faith in God. Real or not He never makes me feel bad about myself. He never laughs at me because of the way I look, He laughs with me. He has literally snatched me from the grip of death on numerous occasions. He has healed my body when doctors had given up hope. Yes indeed, Zoe, it is do the very lack of compassion and the hurtful ways people conduct themselves that my faith has been increased in God.
God bless you, Zoe. And I do not mean for that to sound condescending or appear to be proselytizing. I really pray for Him to bless you.
Well the same to you, doubled!
:)
I will never take amiss a blessing so obviously genuine and from the heart. I wouldn’t take amiss a condescending one or a prosletysing one either,for that matter, because a blessing is a blessing.
I feel I already have been blessed. The chances of me being able to be a biological parent were thought to be 100:1 against. As it turned out, they were incalculably smaller. My particular syndrome is so rare, only a handful of cases documented, that we can’t know the true odds. I have a son, and that is a blessing beyond price, I was a dry tree, but not completely. Not quite.
I better explain. In 1985, I went to a fertility clinic. I was diagnosed there on the basis of a physical examination and some blood tests as a “mildly intersexed male”. I looked male, mostly. The same symptoms as Partial AI syndrome, which can only be diagnosed by a physical exam even today. Complete AI syndrome leads to a completely female appearance, and various grades of Partial AI to either a masculinised women, or a feminised man. I looked like a linebacker - if you ignored the skeletal and genital anomalies. I thought this was particularly unfair though. My gender identity had always been female. Bad enough to have a body that looked terribly male, so much so that I had to do the “Boy Act”. Worse for it to be a defective version.
Simplifying, in May 2005 I started having a female puberty, much to everyone’s consternation. Mine too, I was a happily married man, with a son- though his conception took technical help, as I lacked a complete set of genitalia. I still was a TS woman, but there are many masculine virtues I admire, and tried to live up to. To be the best man any woman could be. I endured and was content.
After many thousands of dollars worth of tests, MRI scans, ultrasounds, gene tests, endocrine (hormone) tests, the diagnosis was changed. By then I didn’t look remotely male, I was 2/3 the mass I was before, and a very different shape. It was decided that overall, I was more accurately described as a “severely androgenised non-pregnant woman” to quote the exact diagnosis.
Most such “natural sex changes” are from female at birth to male later, due to either 5ARD syndrome or 17BHDD syndrome. Less than 1% go the other way, it’s incredibly rare, one in several million.
So my Transsexuality, a cross I’d born without complaint for 47 years, was suddenly lifted from me. I’ll never be a cover girl, except possibly on National Geographic as someone who looks exactly like their reconstruction of a Neanderthal female. Seriously, my head looks normal, the rest…. could be a lot worse considering.
I needed surgery to remove atrophied and dysfunctional glands that were a cancer risk, and to replumb the urethra. Things were rather a mess there, unlike Clownfish, the change in humans is never complete. I opted for a full reconstruction, so look normal now for the first time in my life. I no longer have to avoid changing rooms. My body feels normal, a part of me, rather than something i wear that doesn’t fit.
I still face some really interesting legal problems, as laws are not set up for people who change sex without treatment. The social problems you can imagine, ranging from the tragic to the utterly hilarious. My partner, the love of my life, and the mother of my child (and do you have ANY IDEA how bizarre that sounds????) is still with me, but of course our relationship is chaste. Intercourse was never possible of course, but there had been physical intimacy. But she’s no lesbian, and after the change, and to my profound discomfort, neither am I. 51 is a bit late to start dating though, especially when you have to say “Oh by the way, i used to look like a man…”. Such an admission is likely to lead to a ,long stay in Intensive Care.
But even that is not the most miraculous thing. For that, please read my article Blessings Contrasts and Christianity.
Hugs and God Bless, Zoe
I must say, Zoe, you definitely had me cracking up (with you not at you). I could here the humor even as I was reading. And too, you are indeed very blessed. You have endured and come out victorious in your battles. It has been my pleasure to share my opinions and read your responses. By the way, my name is Alesia and I am no Rocket Scientist…lol. In fact, my greatest accomplishment is motherhood for which I am extremely proud.
Alesia - a few tears on the keyboard I’m afraid - I would have traded all my life’s experiences, all the technical accomplishments I’ve ever had, the Engineering Excellence Awards…. if I could have been a mother like you.
I got a triple dose of “maternal instinct” in my peculiar neurology, you see.
But I must count my blessings, because I did get second prize. I’m the parent of my son, even if I didn’t give birth to him as I should have.
I guess that’s why these “pregnant man” stories resonate. They’re mirror-images of my own situation, and although I don’t understand men at all, I can understand how a guy would do anything, anything at all, to become a father. Or as close as he could get to that.
My son exists. The hows and wherefores don’t matter, do they? So why am I crying? I should consider all the other women who can’t bear children for medical reasons, and they don’t even get a shot at second prize either. My heart goes out to them.
I had no monthly curse. No cramps. No morning sickness. No backache. No labour, No episiotemy scissors. No stretchmarks. I should be grateful, shouldn’t I? Even if it does cause certain complications. “So what is your relationship to Andrew?” “Er, um, I’m actually his biological father… it’s complicated….”
Ah well. Motherhood was not my lot in life. It should have been though. C’est la vie.
Thanks so much for telling me this. I guess the grass is always greener, right? And what does it matter as long as we have the children, to love, to cherish, to protect, and sometimes to get exasperated with! And to sing an Honest Lullaby to.
Hugs again, and another God Bless,
Zoe
This is to the Atheist, first of all when i said “i wonder if the ones who so call say that there’s no God read the Bible before and taken in a deep understanding of it” that was a question that i was wondering not an foolish statement. Everyone is entittled to having questions and oppinions. And i don’t know where you get off trying to educate me because i get educated from God’s word the Holy scriptures where it says at (2 Timothy 3:16) “All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness”. Take for example you are a secretary and your boss want’s you to write an letter. He tells you everything to write and you write it down exactly as he say, and then you mail it off for him. Is that your letter or his. No it’s not yours it’s his you just wrote it for him. Even though you wrote it, it’s still inspired by him because it’s his words. Same goes for the Bible their God’s words but he had about fourty different men to write it. So therefore the Bible is inspired By God. By saying what you said “Perhaps if you read a little bit more and gained a greater understanding of things, you wouldn’t be pressed to make foolish statements that you cannot back up.” Don’t you think that’s a little childish to say? And tell me this Mr. or Ms. educator if there’s no God and the Bible is not inspired by God and you read the Bible before, how come the Bible to be written a thousand years ago or just about that it foretells the times that we live in now? As (2 Timothy 3:1-5) says: “But know this, that in the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here. 2 For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, self-assuming, haughty, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, disloyal, 3 having no natural affection, not open to any agreement, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, without love of goodness, 4 betrayers, headstrong, puffed up [with pride], lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God, 5 having a form of godly devotion but proving false to its power; and from these turn away.” Now tell me have you witness any of this such as ones being selfish, lovers of money(always trying to find a way to get rich quick), not open to any agreement( as you can see alot of this been going on, on this website). And how does the Bible also fortells when the presence of Jesus Christ comming? As (Matthew 24:3) says:While he was sitting upon the Mount of Olives, the disciples approached him privately, saying: “Tell us, When will these things be, and what will be the sign of your presence and of the conclusion of the system of things?”. (Matthew 24:6):”YOU are going to hear of wars and reports of wars; see that YOU are not terrified. For these things must take place, but the end is not yet.” (Matthew 24:7-8) Says: “For nation will rise against nation and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be food shortages and earthquakes in one place after another. 8 All these things are a beginning of pangs of distress.” If you watch the news or look at the news papper, you can’t lie and say you haven’t hear of wars(Iraq) and you can’t say haven’t heard of earthquakes destroying people homes or alot of hungry children in differents countries dying of starvation. can you explain that. So don’t be to quick to say i can’t back up what i say because i have knowledge, and where do i get that God’s Holy scriptures. And this is for Zoe Brain yes that answer my question. But are you trying to say that i’m a unkind person that down people (i know this is not your exact words) by saying this ” if you lack Kindness, you’re wasting your time.” (If not please disregard what i’m saying, i apologise), but As (Zechariah 7:9) says: “and carry on with one another loving-kindness and mercies.” so you see my dear as i say plenty of times i’m not perfect but i do all my best to show love and kindness to everyone no matter who they are, but that doesn’t mean i will tolerate wrongdoing. So both of you have to get to know ones to say such things.
re (2 Timothy 3:1-5)
but didnt you just prove the atheists point?! i mean, you used scripture about the coming of the end of time, but the scripture used could mean any time not just now. there were wars, homosexuals, disbelievers, etc all throughout history. all you are doing is repeating scripture to try and make a point, but you arent getting anywhere with your point
its all well & good to quote scripture, but if youre gonna do it, at least spell & use grammar right
the athiest at least sounds educated even if i dont agree w/her oppinion
“as i say plenty of times i’m not perfect but i do all my best to show love and kindness to everyone no matter who they are”
That’s all that’s asked. Acknowledgement of one’s own imperfections, and to treat others with the same tolerance for imperfection that your ask for yourself from God. To chide, but not to persecute. To correct others as you’d wish them to correct you when you (to put it bluntly and impolitely) screw up.
I hope to live up to your example.
Personally, the people I have greatest difficulty treating with forebearance and charity are those who just quote 1 Timothy 2:11-12 at me to dismiss what I say and tell me to shut up.
hey zoe - you sound pretty intelligent too, but i was referencing the anonymous atheist. well i am a believer in god, i do believe to each his own. the guy quoting the scriptures at the atheist got under my skin because the particular scriptures he used didnt prove any kind of point that he thought he could or was trying to make
r zoe brian and the athiest the same perosn?
It’s Brain not brian, and no, I don’t use sockpuppets, nor hide behind anonymity.
John 3
20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
Not that I claim that my deeds are wrought in God. Just that I’m unashamed of them - even if many think I should be.
Honestly, Zoe, I haven’t seen nor heard you say or do anything that you should be ashamed of. You have presented scientific argument and quoted the Word rather knowledgeably. Additionally, you said in an earlier comment “I don’t have enough faith to be an atheist”. It does require an awful lot of faith to be an atheist.
I only wish that others (myself included) could be so articulate and less of a mudslinger (or should I say sound less hateful) when voicing my/their opinions.
First of all i’m a female, and when i was quoting the scriptures, never did i say that we were in the last days now, i know that all these things happen way before now, but things are getting worse. What she or he the Atheist sound educated because maybe she or he had said something they read from a book or something. Tell me what point did you think i was trying to make he or she doesn’t belive in God or the Bible, i was quoting what the Bible says and whats in the Bilble you can see today just as much as you seen it back then.
I think that its wrong for a ‘man’ to be pregnant. If he wanted to be a man i have nothing against that but GOD create men and women different for a reason. Its wrong to mess with nature.
SUNDAY LAW IS COMING!….BE PREPARE…